You can even make your own waffer fuse holder. Get some plastic, two bolts and some nuts and washers.

Make a base with the plastic, 1/2 thick is good for strenth.
Put the waffer fuse on the plastic and mark the centers of the mounting holes.
Use bolts that will fit in the mounting holes.
Drill the holes for the bolts.
Counter sink the bottom of the plastic so the bolts are flush with the bottom.
Put bolts in and put one washer and nut on.
Then you can mount your wire with ring terminals to the bolts.
put another washer on, then the fuse, then a washer and another nut.

There, home made waffer fuse holder, but only if you're cheapo!

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ANL fuse is still $20. Make some out of tinfoil?

__________________
I'm for a stronger death penalty.
-George Bush

Japanese hotel:
You are invited to take advantage of the maid.

Typically the only difference in RCA's is going to be in the build quality..

Keep in mind that twisted RCA's can only cancel induced noise if your amplifier has balanced or differential inputs... most do not...

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SIC Audio

Twisted RCA's never CANCEL noise, they simply reject most (or some) or the noise that can be induced.

I have never seen a head unit or amplifier in car audio (doesn't mean it doesn't exist) that uses differential inputs, and if it did it would not be through an RCA connection (in pro audio its usually through XLR). Differential needs 3 conductors, a signal +, signal -, and grnd. All RCA connected signals are single ended, unbalanced, whatever you want to call it.

With a balanced signal the cable is not what is rejecting the noise, the technology/hardware is. At the source end, the original signal is send down signal +, the inverted signal is sent down signal - and the foil is the reference grnd. At the recieving end the signal - is inverted again and the 2 signals are summed. This means that any signal that is not the exact same on both signal + and signal - is just induced noise and is rejected. Don't confuse this with processing either, this is all done through a simple analog opamp at either end.

Darn shame they don't use balanced signals in car audio. I use it whenever I can in home audio, and it was almost always used when I did pro audio.

__________________
I'm for a stronger death penalty.
-George Bush

Japanese hotel:
You are invited to take advantage of the maid.

^ dude, you don't know what you are talking about.

First of all the purpose of twisting signal wires is that any induced noise enters the conductors out of phase, and quite literally cancels itself out as the signal is summed at the amplifier... this only works if ground is either hot or floats and the difference between the conductors is taken....


Balanced and pseudo-balanced (differential) lines do not need to use a seperate reference ground either.. check out the balanced wires comming out of the ethernet card in the back of your computer, they run in pairs....

shielding is only effective at attenuating capacitively induced noise, and since it's rarley a problem I wouldn't worry about it... otherwise it acts as an antena and inceases the loop area of your RCAs...

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SIC Audio

I do know what I am talking about.

Simply twisting a cable doesn't put induced fields on one conductor out of phase with the other. If that were true, than the whole point of balanced cables would be… well, backwards. If signal+ carries the original signal and signal- carries the inverse phase, then, according to you, noise would be induced on signal+ and then on signal- out of phase. When the receiver inverts signal- and sums both, the noise would be a valid signal because it would be in phase again.

Music enters signal+ in phase and signal- out of phase (now called differential voltage). Noise enters both conductors in phase (called common mode voltage), the receiver inverts one signal (signal-), the music is now back in phase on both conductors so is valid when they are summed, the noise on signal + is then out of phase with noise on signal- and is cancelled when the signals are summed.
The real reason why twisting signal wires is effective is because it reduces magnetic field coupling (works for both balanced and unbalanced) provided that the signal flow on both conductors is equal and opposite, and that the length of twist is smaller than necessary (1/20th of the smallest wavelength) NOT because noise enters the conductors out of phase.

Also, pseudo-differential (I'm assuming that's what you meant) does still have a reference ground, just not in the cable, it's tied through a small value resistor from signal- to the equipments' ground, and it's only effective at DC voltage rejection, not AC.

The majority of this has nothing to do with the original post, but when you say I don't know what I'm talking about....

__________________
I'm for a stronger death penalty.
-George Bush

Japanese hotel:
You are invited to take advantage of the maid.

No, you don't... and about 98% of your post is complete nonsense.... sorry bud, but you are quickly transitioning from a state of ignorence to that of stupidity....

The first blatently obvious flaw in your 'explination' is that if a reciever inverted one half of two equal but opposite signals, then there would no longer be any difference in voltage to amplify...

You also seem clueless as to the difference between a balanced and a differential system...


You have made at least one valid point about twisted wire; and that is that the loop area between the conductors is small which reduces the amount of noise which can be induced.. balanced, differential, or not.... on the otherhand the difference in loop area between a twisted RCA and an RCA with two conductors side by side is going to be nill....

The fact that loop area is small is basically icing on the cake when compared to something like coax...

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SIC Audio

When I say reciever, it's what's recieved the balanced signal (inside the chassis of the amplifier), the signal has already travelled from the source and inside the reciver it inverts signal- just before it sends it through it's amplified stage.

So, to make sure we're on the same page. Source takes 1 waveform, and sends down signal+ and source takes inverse and sends down signal-. The difference in voltage occurs because as signal+ increases in voltage, signal- decreases in voltage and vise versa. This also means you have equal and opposite voltage. Then inside the amplifier is when signal- is inverted, the two signals are summed, and the noise will cancel as it hits the opamp that does this because the noise will be equal but out of phase, not because it entered the lines out of phase, but because the opamp puts them out of phase all on the recieving end. This sends a single ended unbalanced signal through the few inches of copper on a circuit board to the amplification part of the amplifiers circuitry.

What is the difference between balanced and differential, I've always read and been told the terms are interchangeable.

The book "The Audiophile's Project Sourcebook" has an entire chapter on how the opamps manipulate the signal, how to make your own baluns and transformers and breaks down how both balanced and unbalanced signals work. It's a good reliable book that is way more accurate than alot of what is on the internet. There are many others, but that one breaks it down very well.

If you want me to do any direct quoteing, it'll have to wait until sunday when I get home.

__________________
I'm for a stronger death penalty.
-George Bush

Japanese hotel:
You are invited to take advantage of the maid.

I see what you're getting at.... You're talking about amps where the - floats. Well, then the signal never does get inverted inside the amp, they are amplified in two seperate stages and instead of summing it is now subtracting. Same difference, now it's happening on the output stage, when it subtracts the inverse from the original it still produces the original in phase signal, when you subtract commom mode voltage(noise) your net is still 0.

The amp I was describing had - tied to grnd on the output side.

My point still stands, if the noise is induced out of phase in the signal lines, than it gets reproduce with the music, in both scenarios the noise has to be in phase on both lines and the music be out of phase.

__________________
I'm for a stronger death penalty.
-George Bush

Japanese hotel:
You are invited to take advantage of the maid.

^ fair enough... but my point still stands as well... unless your amp has balanced or differential inputs then twisted pair isn't going to have any significant noise rejection over regular RCA's....

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SIC Audio